Your email: Password [ reset ]
   -> create a personal or business account for free in seconds!




where moroccans click!


about · terms
PEOPLE
GROUPS
BUSINESSES
DISCUSSIONS
728 members
8 groups, 40 businesses
1140 discussions, 13544 comments

ART & CULTURE
Rasta Gnawi
boston, ma Massachusetts USA
Share on facebook
6
comments.
Arabica
12:34:43 PM Wednesday Sep 24, 2008


Here is one of the most interesting articles that I've read in a long time. It deals with the dual language system in Morocco and its effect on social/economic growth. It also talks about the problem of having darija and fus'ha; very light discussion. No deep mention of tmazight.

Can Morocco chart a linguistic path for itself, or is it something endogenous to its cultural evolution? Which drives which, culture drives language, or the other way around?

Would love to hear thoughts on this.


The content of this page —graphics, text and other elements—is © Copyright 2007 prospective author, and Raioo, Inc., only when stated otherwise, and may not be reprinted or retransmitted in whole or in part without the expressed written consent of the publisher.



Where Moroccans Click!
Create an account in seconds
to start new topics, leave comments, express yourself, make Moroccan friends and Morocco-loving friends, build long lasting connections, buy and sell, join groups and events, share photos, cook, message, and more.





1:55 pm    September 29, 2008

hudhud message
6
you just reminded me of a friend of my mother's from qouds. she speaks to her children only in fus'ha and tries to do the same with all her friends and acquaintances too. interestingly enough, all the arabs here understand her, but I've only heard my mom converse with her in fus'ha. everyone else just continues answering this woman in their own dialects.

my grandfather, despite being berber, would only let his children speak fus'ha arabic at home. after he died, french and darja took over, especially since all his kids ended up in french schools despite his years of struggling to avoid that. he was afraid his kids would grow up not knowing how to pick up the quran and read and understand it for themselves.

sure enough, last year I met 2 of his great grandchildren, who neither spoke a word of arabic nor knew how to read quran or pray. it was a bit shocking for me, especially because both their parents a) knew and were fluent in arabic, 2) did pray and read quran, albeit not regularly.

it somehow fell off the priority list for some of the later generation apparently.

·

8:14 pm    September 27, 2008

Rasta Gnawi message
5
I don't know a lot about the French lobby in Morocco. I enjoyed learning French. It's an elegant language. There is a stigma attached to people who speak it on a regular basis in the streets and at home; but it's a minor inconvenience to most people at worst.

The real issue is that Morocco has a language called darija, and another called fus'ha. They are quite different. One has to make a real effort to be good at fus'ha because it is spoken neither at home nor in the streets. Other languages are much simpler in that regard. The french you speak in the street is the same as the one you communicate with in school. The same goes for english, italian, spanish, etc.

The way I see it, either we have a real language barrier to cultural development, or we have an incredible advantage in that we can think and communicate in different languages simultaneously. I happen to judge people by the poems they write, the imagery they use in the poems and the words they use to describe the imagery. Arabic is superior in that regard. But to get to the level of mastery required to spit out good poems, fus'ha has to be second nature, part of your DNA. For us, darija is in our dna more than fus'ha. In fact, fus'ha reminds us of final exams, school, etc. So achieving higher standards remains limited to the few that have dedicated lots of time and energy to cultivating knowledge of fus'ha.

Darija poems are also good, but not great. Unless you're listening to some nice old song by a 3erfa or gellath chekh.

So my recommendation is to improve the fus'ha education at school and increase its exposure through media. I disagree with the writer of the article that there should be some rapprochement between fus'ha and darija. They are different languages and ought to be looked at as such. Let darija evolve in the streets and at home. Keep fus'ha standardized but increase people's exposure to it so as to turn it into a second nature language.

·

8:34 pm    September 26, 2008

hudhud message
4
It's a long standing dilemma. I can say this for a fact, the French language still dominates in neighboring Algeria, used on legal documents and spoken heavily by the majority of the population. As an uncle once remarked to me, "Our Arabic is 95% French. And the part that is not French is so badly broken it no longer counts as Arabic."
And that was coming from a Berber man quite proud of his Amazigh roots.

But to be honest, the dilemma I find more tragic is not so much the widespread use of French, as that can be explained by the long years of colonial rule whose effects (linguistic, economic, political, and psychological no less) cannot be erased in a day.

No, what I find even more tragic is the argument by many of our own people that darja should become the standard written Arabic used in literature, journalism, etc.

Language is a clearly powerful way to shape a person's identity. As linguists and psychologists alike will tell you, a human being thinks *in* language. You do not think in a vaccuum. You use words to think about your world and express yourself. And those words are from a certain language, which has its history, its origins, its cultural values and "baggage" if you will, be it good or .. not so good.

·

12:54 pm    September 26, 2008

Blooming Warda message
3
Actually I do not see any linguistic problems in Morocco at all. Most of our official documents use arabic as the main language (Marriage certificate are issued in Arabic, Divorce decrees are issued in Arabic, birth certificates, certificates of residence, National ID), TV, Radio, in the street, everybody speaks our beloved dialect and classical arabic. French is also used in the moroccan administration but it's only complimentary.

French is the main language in the Private sectors as is English. Our public schools teach mainly in Arabic, only private schools teach in French or English, and there are a few Moroccans who can afford to go to private schools. So no worries, French is not degrading our identity it's adding to it.

I would love to know on what basis do people claim that the language used in Morocco is French? As Moroccans we should not lie to ourselves and believe that we speak french on a regular basis as some foreigners think. We speak Arabic and we happen to learn French at an early age, that does not make us French speakers more than Arabic speakers.

·

2:15 pm    September 24, 2008

Salem message
2
The stake is huge, I think. The french lobby is very strong. The economic and social links with France are too strong. However, we can notice that there is a growing awareness of the importance of English in the globalization era. But still french is dominating and gaining even more ground with the development of private education that aim to give to its "product" a distinctive ability in the job market: fluency in french. Such a "product" tend to ignore Arabic by snobism.

I recently noticed an interesting phenomena in the satellite Arabic stations. Many of them, for some reason, show exclusively Hollywood movies (American English) subtitled in Arabic 24/24, 7/7. I myself watch these stations frequently. I noticed also that these stations are becoming quite popular. And you know what, for some Moroccans the only opportunity to READ IN ARABIC is watching these movies§.

·

2:14 pm    September 24, 2008

Salem message
1
The stake is huge, I think. The french lobby is very strong. The economic and social links with France are too strong. However, we can notice that there is a growing awareness of the importance of English in the globalization era. But still french is dominating and gaining even more ground with the development of private education that aim to give to its "product" a distinctive ability in the job market: fluency in french. Such a "product" tend to ignore Arabic by snobism.

I recently noticed an interesting phenomena in the satellite Arabic stations. Many of them, for some reason, show exclusively Hollywood movies (American English) subtitled in Arabic 24/24, 7/7. I myself watch these stations frequently. I noticed also that these stations are becoming quite popular. And you know what, for some Moroccans the only opportunity to READ IN ARABIC is watching these movies§.

·

Rasta Gnawi's notes (63)
 
2012
Ramadan Mubarak..
Raioo versus Facebook..
 
2010
Mercy..
 
2009
eid?..
Ramdan Mabrouk..
rantings on a cloudy day..
Sardines..
 
2008
drought..
salma salma..
Arabica..
agricultural / energy policy..
Doucement :)..
Mebrouk Remdan..
ghir bessyas a moulay!..
ONB - anyone going to concert or has tickets?..
 
2007
Darfur..
Friday or Saturday?..
douga douga..
Cartoon Memories..
mudhakkiratou rihlati ljanoub..
From Africa, with love..
great film..
spicy chocolate..
a treat for you..
Nice piece for your weekend activities..
Another attempt at writing. Will this language ever feel nat..
 
2006
Eid Mebrouk..
satellite..
Mebrouk Ramdan..
mshwi..
old fiction..
MS Mess..
their life... our life... their life.....
Islamic punk rock..
One Love..
free speech..
Resources..
Hammam ruminations..
old paintings..
date deals..
 
2005
dmv..
book..
casa..
vortex..
name of the rose..
mostafa Akkad..
Eurika..
audioslave..
Paris riots..
Eid Mabrouk..
NYT lamb..
recipe..
badi3..
a pause from madness..
garden..
desert nights..
brain freeze..
organized tours..
passport on vacation..
good attire..
Hot day..
 
2002
eCommerce..
Econ - Biz - What's The Pulse..


FAVORITES
.
.






about raioo ~ terms
All contents © copyright 1999-2017 for Adnane Benali and respective authors. Aside from properly referencing and linking content, No duplication, reproduction, or reprinting of raioo writings, artwork and/or related content allowed without written permission from the respective author or publisher (raioo.com).

where moroccans click!