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SPIRITUAL
Adnane Ben.
Boston USA
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97
comments.
Islam and You, Face to Face Now.
12:00:00 AM Wednesday Mar 31, 2004



These days, as fatal attacks carried by or traced to some individual "Muslims" motivated by what has come to be known as the "war on terrorism", many Muslims and non-Muslims alike start questioning the religion of Islam and its role in all of this.

In many forums across the internet, you come to hear some "Muslims" bashing their own religion, feeling guilty and confused. Do you find yourself as one of them? Do you find yourself unable to come with peace with Islam? Are you unable to defend the religion you grew up with in peace, in these times of turbulence? Do you find yourself losing faith? staying away from the mosque? walking away from Islam?

Do you oftentimes ask yourself the question: what can I do to help restore the beauty of Islam as I know it? or do you find yourself asking the question: How can I hide my Muslim identity?

Tell us your stories and be true to yourself.

The content of this page —graphics, text and other elements—is © Copyright 2007 prospective author, and Raioo, Inc., only when stated otherwise, and may not be reprinted or retransmitted in whole or in part without the expressed written consent of the publisher.



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5:14 pm    April 10, 2004
mb
97
http://www.lefigaro.fr/magazine/20040408.MAG0013.html
·

5:00 am    April 8, 2004
Mistara
96
95
Certain folks avoid discussing the Details of the issue, and show up only as throw on poeple's face dogmatic quotes taken out of their context...
By having such an attitude, there would be no room for an honest open debate...
There is no such thing as "take it of leave it"...Learn that !

Certain patherns of thinking do cause problems, and we have change that...
Don't unswer just for the sake of typing...there is no need to turn the forum into a Hammam discussion full of empty arguments...

·

8:15 pm    April 7, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
95
Let`s clear thing here :

Bahja,
I replied to hanan, saying walemmen t3awed zaborek a daoued, this saying in morocco we use it to tell people that we have been saying this for a long time, but people don`t want to understand.... i didn`t point my finger to any body.

Hanan,
it was not you who were assuming, that message was to bahja not to you...

you guys need to stop sniffing that thing...

·

6:11 pm    April 7, 2004
Peaceful
94
87
if your goal is to know the truth, then you are totally allowed to ask any question you have in mind that is creating confusion for you. in fact the kuran says: wass2alo ahla ddikri in kontom la ta3lamoune" ask pple of knowledge if u dont know.
peace
·

2:50 pm    April 7, 2004
arawalia
93
70
poverty+nondemocraty=terrorism
islam is peace my brother ....
allah ighfer lina wi rhmna
·

1:37 pm    April 7, 2004
Hanan
92
88
I was assuming anything I quoted a part of the article.
that's all :)
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11:26 am    April 7, 2004
Bahja
91
88
I am sorry if i was rude. But just by reading your 85 message, no good!
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11:09 am    April 7, 2004

abdelilah message
90
Until May 16 in Morocco, the ministry of religious affairs didn't have a great role in such a Muslim country, how ironic. The King announced that the ministry undergoes radical changes, become more active and embrace higher responsibilities.


The ministry of religious affairs sided with the Islamic parties before in the time of Alaoui Mdaghri and it had a great role and a great say and that is why it is called wizarat siyada.
Now the change came because the actual minister ahmed Tawfiq is a Sufi who has good relations with everybody and the radical changes are coming from him and other people.

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9:32 am    April 7, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
89
85
She was just asking a question..
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9:06 am    April 7, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
88
86
What makes you assume that i think that way???
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8:25 am    April 7, 2004
Hanan
87
"In many forums across the internet, you come to hear some "Muslims" bashing their own religion, feeling guilty and confused."

The problem is that you can't even question Islam, doing so puts you in an outsider box labeled 'confused'.

I do not believe that terrorism has anything to do with this phenomemon , some people simply chose to study in an objective way and question the religion they were born in and when the answers found do not satisfy their personal views on spirituality or when simply logic is abscent from the reasoning that could conduct them to be a muslim, they let go of what they see as a simple set of traditions.

·

8:04 am    April 7, 2004
Bahja
86
84
Do not think that everyone else in this forum is stupid. There are people learning something in this forum still. Respect the others. It is a time where we should all come together and preach good things.
·

7:46 am    April 7, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
85
81
A Moulay----Next time put a concise paragraph down there and avoid this combination of meaningless symbols and mathematics...This is a discussion forum (Ara maandek..)...Spit it out!!!
·

7:12 am    April 7, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
84
83
Lemmen t3awed zaborek a daoued....
·

9:18 pm    April 6, 2004
miriam
83
i think anyone (muslim or not) who links terrorism with islam is severely misguided. terrorism is simply a political tool used by those who feel they have no other way of making their point to a force that is greater than they are. throughout history there have been instances where various forms of terrorism were used as a means to make a political point i.e. countries fighting colonialism, the basque, IRA, mcvey/oklahoma bombing (i think the black panthers? not sure) my point is, as muslims we should not question our religon or feel guilt based on this concept. at this time more than ever, we should strengthen our faith and be able to peacfully defend it.
·

8:18 pm    April 6, 2004
Peaceful
82
61
adnane tkoun be7alo! ila fiddik chi 7aja dire web site owerrina 7enet yeddik. jemilena flhedra lekhaweya.
adnane keep it up
peace!
·

7:16 pm    April 6, 2004
mb
81
75
a sidi ma formula ma walou.....it was a question can t u see the question marksssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss......ou gualek lakher je suis the queen of assumptions....
·

5:20 pm    April 6, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
80
78
Sure, al2akhla9 was way before any other religion existed....
The Prophet(PBUH) said ( Innamma bu3ittou li2outamimma makarima al2akhla9) meaning they were makarim al2akhla9 but not complete, and he(PBUH) with his Religion completed it.

Certainly there are wonderful people out there that don't practice any religion but still are very kind and their manners are the best. they sure going to have sympathy from every body, they sure will be loved by everybody and they will live their lives and die and that`s it..., when they die what did they take with them?? every thing stayed here in Earth, those akhla9 if they were not done liwajhhi ALLAH they will have no value in the here after, certainly it`s good to have good manners, but it is better to have it for a better reason.
The better reason is to do that liwajhi ALLAH.

So I guess they do lack something or somethingS...

·

3:46 pm    April 6, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
79
78
I actually said we need religion to help us stick with values and principles, and not necessarily introduce them to us out of the blue. Religion introduces more elements on top of good values and principles, among which are: God, reward and punishment. I won't talk about God, but I'm forever thankful for the latter elements. The concepts of reward and punishment work very well when you make it work for you just enough so that you live and let live. I can't count enough the times when my Muslim spirituality protected me from hurting things and people, from making bad decisions, and encouraged me to help people, do good things and make correct decisions. It was because of such a personal experience that I said every home can benefit from religion. It would be wrong to question the need for religion just because a few are not utilizing it right. It's like saying, let's close down all departments of chemistry in all the schools of the world, burn all books of chemistry, because someone just mixed some ingredients and produced a fatal gas.

Religion should still shine, be explored, understood. May be what needs to be done well in Muslim countries is to regulate it, like the institutes, NGOs, companies and governments try to regulate chemical research and development.

Until May 16 in Morocco, the ministry of religious affairs didn't have a great role in such a Muslim country, how ironic. The King announced that the ministry undergoes radical changes, become more active and embrace higher responsibilities. that's what should be done by leadership: ensure that religion is regulated well, understood and applies peacefully.

·

2:35 pm    April 6, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
78
76
Adnane,
I am still not convinced with your explanation. Coz people can adopt principles without religion, the "Akhlaq" were already principles of the Greek methology before even the other religions. Plz refer to Platonic kingdom and other philosophers in this regards..
It's just religion is linked a lot with the state of the existence, and gives clues about some historical backgrounds of the universe, human evolution and give an idea about who created the universe..
People are attached to religion because of a confused status they live, the multiple questions we have of who created the world and it must better be good!!! and miraculously it should be somebody who is ideal, out of the imagination or ordinary who "give a quick shrift" of creating the world...A Superpower: God, Allah etc..That's why people keep sticking to religions as the backbone and the line that regulates lives. There's people who doesn't believe in religion and are: honest, straightforward, faithful, does not steal, serious, peaceful, human, helpful etc.. you can add up as much attributes as you want...Do you think they lack something?
·

2:19 pm    April 6, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
77
71
I didn`t say they were all poor, and i mentioned that the poor are only a material but those behind them aren`t poor at all, since they provide them with money...
Uneducated on their religion, cause if they were well educated about their religion they would know that what they commited was horrible....
There are so many uneducated people but they know something about their religion and notany body can convince them about any thing that doesn`t make sense....

Poverty is part of it but the whole thing....

·

2:09 pm    April 6, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
76
75
We do need religion to help us stick with good values and principles. I think every home can benefit from a good religion. Probably what you are asking is to have the State seperate from Religion just enough so that Religion thrives in the home, and the State protects everyone.
·

1:37 pm    April 6, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
75
70
Your formula is just incorrect and not logical at all....maybe those criminals terrorists are poor but not money-wise (Media talked about that) ..the issue is that they have a poor vision..a dark vision..Secondly, Islam is innocent of them (baraata yaakob (Jacob)).they are imposters, people who has no human dignity and love for life...they have a dark vision of the future and the present, worshipping blindly the past in a very controversial way. Look at this idiot of Osama who left all good things of life and endangering human beings, kids, innocents, his relatives and himself for the sake of some thoughts makes himself look like a deranged maniac (which is definitely true)...probably he needed fame...but look at him he's been hiding like a rat..chosen to live miserable like any other looser who think like him.
If poverty is the true reason for this rebellious behavior why those people they don't fight against their governments and governers who took advantage of them for years. The US should not be aimed or punished on any shape or form!!
Like all religions Islam is bringing up peace, stability and co-existence! people who love those 3 principles do live happy and moderate..People who choose the other backward path and want to show off that they are more than a regular peaceful muslim and trying to make "much ado about nothing"..those need to revise their thoughts coz there's something wrong them.
In response to "Lococo" in his post #36, most of that stuff you were talking about happened even in the prophet's era or even after (abbasseyin or Omawiyyin..etc.) do you think that Islam was practiced 100%---You're kidding me. There were prostitues, bars, slavery (even worst), homosexuality, thieves etc...so don't make of nowadays look like rediculous and look at the past as the golden age!! You seem to be more hard-liner and heading towards extremist ideas, and it's a shame on you and people similar to you or whoever support you!!!
Another thing, the media never brought to the spotlight Islam and a bad image of Islam in a bad way (I guess except Fox News and Bill Oreilly bashing muslims with a green light from his Boss), other media corp. were very conservative and neutral in presenting info., the issue is just arabs are always paranoid!!
Another subject that I wanna raise here is have ever thought about this: "Why do we need religion?"
If Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, and Christianity all preach about peace, being good, helpful, faithful and love life and humanity...We can do that without sticking to any of these religions...Can we? It's just a matter of adopting principles?
(Please Do Not consider this as a preaching or teaching or whatever you'd call it for secularism?)
Thx.

·

12:52 pm    April 6, 2004
Bahja
74
Poverty+ loss of dignity (colonialism, West monoplialism....) + luck of hope + no GF, no Job + pride (from history :Arabs) + lack of sophistication (F16, tornado...)+ hope of better life (Jenna) = willingness to end your life(potrential to become terrorist).

I can develop a model using these inputs, I will need some data to validate my model!
Again, the driving force is not Islam and the proof is that suicide boming did occur in the past inJapan and in other part of the world before Arabs start using it as a weapon .
Hope it helps

·

12:44 pm    April 6, 2004

Antr McShaddad (Yahia.L) message
73
68
The moroccans now, are less poor than they have been 50 years ago. yet none of them was blowing himself up among the crowd, not even when the french settlers were around...

Poeple in Haiti, Jamaica and Romania are more poor than poeple in Morocco, yet, no Haitian immigrant blows up a hotel in Miami, and no Albanian blows up an Italian train, just because he is poor...etc...

A poor person can be driven to commit a crime as to gain a meterial reward ...but a terrorist ready to kill himself and others with him, is rather driven by a bad mix between a political aim and a misinterpreted religious concept (Jihad) .

·

11:28 am    April 6, 2004
___rasta___
72
71
sweet
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11:06 am    April 6, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
71
68
Not all of them are poor. Some are rich. Not all of them are not well educated, some have high degrees. But then again, it depends what you mean exactly by "poor" and by "well educated". I've personnaly seen people with high degrees but corrupt and morally detestable. I've seen poor people with great lives and morals.
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10:52 am    April 6, 2004
mb
70
68

poverty + islam = terrorism ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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10:49 am    April 6, 2004
mb
69
68
nego....

Kutiba 3alaykoumou al9italou wa houa kurhoun lakoum, 3assa an takrahou chay2an wa houa khayroun lakoum...)

before assuming anything wrong from what it said above...can i ask you what is meant by wa houwa kurhoun lakoum....:))))....u see i am not really jumping on every little thing u say ....

When you say Religion is the source of all this isnt that a justification??

who were u addressing this to????? me???? i never said that religion had something to do with that ...!!!!!! i said there must be something wrong with "notre education"....please stop putting words in my mouth.....never blamed islam of anything...at least this time....:))))

·

10:10 am    April 6, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
68
65
Ouai je vis ds mon petit monde a moi, et alors ? est ce ke c 3ayb? wella 7aram?
The guy said they have Islam in common i stated another thing in common, to show that it isn`t only Islam that they have in common there are other facts as well, never said it was only Poverty that pushed them to do so...but been the Queen of assumptions- i wasn`t surprise to see you jumping again on that conclusion that poverty is the ONLY factor that pushes people to do such horrible acts ( Palestinians not included) .
To explain things to you-hoping this time you won`t make another assumption-
There are Criminals in these countries there are fanatics that wants to prove something to their GOVs in order to do that , they need volunteers, they go to those who are touched by poverty to seek what they want from them cause it is easier to influence them.
I`ll explain more(again hoping this will make you NOT assume).

Poverty ---> No education or not enough---> a desperate person who wants money

Those fanatics are looking for these desperate men they give them Money promise them wealth and promise them Heaven...etc, of course those been not well educated they will believe them, and there you go ....you have a Bomb walking in the street, he hates the world cause they made him hate all rich people, they made him think that they stole his money(not giving zakat) they made him think that no body cares about him etc....
When you say Religion is the source of all this isnt that a justification?? it looks to me like it is , but i don`t think the same way you do, so i say that Religion , poverty and uneducation are not justifications but Facts , there is a reason behind every act....

ou est ce ke notre religion ns demande vraiment de nous battre et defendre ainsi?????( chose peu probable....)
( Kutiba 3alaykoumou al9italou wa houa kurhoun lakoum, 3assa an takrahou chay2an wa houa khayroun lakoum...)

·

9:23 am    April 6, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
67
58
What about Nipal ? what about south americans ? what about the Non Muslim Indos....

As u said we really do have some genius in this Forum...
but it`s hard to figure who he is since he keeps changing his Nick...r u hiding from something?

·

8:25 am    April 6, 2004
mb
66
53
A WOMAN IS RAPED EVERY MIN IN THE U.S..... good at least we can see numbers in the u.s....a thing that u can t really do in morocco....come on don t give me that ...i am pretty sure millions of women get raped in morocco ...but the difference is : here they go to the police ...in morocco a woman would be ashamed to tell even her closest friend ...because it s 3ib, 7chouma, la honte sera sur tt la famille ...because she s gonna be the one society will blame...she s gonna be seen as a wh... and sl... women are raped by their husbands in morocco...just think about the number of girls that were forced to marry a guy their family chose for them...ce ki se passe kand le mariage est consomme n est surement pas un choix fait par les deux...and that s a rape.....
i am not blaming religion ...at all...i am blaming the way our dear society sees things....all those taboos...all those things we can t talk about with our families...there is no communication ...how can we move forward if we don t communicate...some sick ppl don t say a word until one day their families get a visit from the police saying that their nice and quiet son is dead...died as a human bomb in a hotel in casablanca ...ohhhh c est de la folie ca ....
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7:57 am    April 6, 2004
mb
65
56
nego.....
je t envie vraiment...tu vis ds ton petit monde...tu vois juste ce ke tu veux voir....oui la pauverete est un point commun ...la religion aussi....et n oublis surtt pas k on partage ce point commun don t tu parles "la pauverete" avec plein d autres pays non musulmans....un bon nombre de pays africain, asiatique et sud americain....je me demande pkoi ces gens ne se transforme pas en bombe humaine??????????? je me le demande vraiment...est ce notre facon de voir le monde a travers un point de vue religieux??? est ce notre facon de comprendre la religion et ce ki est demande de ns par le coran? ou est ce k on est juste trop manipule par les media et des gens corrompu et assoife de pouvoir??????? ou est ce ke notre religion ns demande vraiment de nous battre et defendre ainsi?????( chose peu probable....)
arretons de tt mettre sur le dos de la pauverete......c est pas juste....les gens ont tjs vecu pauvre au maroc...mais ont tjs garde leur dignite et n ont jamais salis l image du pays ou de la religion....il doit y avoir qqch vi va pas ds l education des nouvelles generations....
Nego , arrete de defendre l indefendable...je ne comprends pas pkoi y a des gens ki essaye de justifier des actes horribles ...ahhh c est a cause de la pauverete...ah on leur a pris leurs maison...leurs terres....rien ne justifie la mort de gens innocents.....
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7:40 am    April 6, 2004

Antr McShaddad (Yahia.L) message
64
63
PS : the very last sentence in the first part of the show, was said by the president Ronald Reagan during a speech atthe UN .
I wonder what he meant by that, if he meant anything at all ...

·

7:23 am    April 6, 2004

Antr McShaddad (Yahia.L) message
63
Interesting...

http://www.dubaibuzz.com/shadows/nwo1.rm
http://www.dubaibuzz.com/shadows/nwo2.rm

Enjoy !

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5:13 am    April 6, 2004
7areg
62
60
Salam looser
very funny, what a looser. a true idiot mentality
where do y'all come from ??? first of all you do NOT have the right to deport anybody simply because I believe that Immigrants cannot deport other Immigrants. is that all you've got to say?

People like you deserve the shitty life, misery and wretchedness of the country you crawled from.
you make me sick, ignorance a no manners whatsoever.
llay legui'ha lik ya 3addouwe llah
and why don't you call CIA FBI and... bush while you're @ it ??? we're still here aren't we ???
what an idiot
sir llay ye3tike al 3adab

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2:49 am    April 6, 2004
anti_Jihad
61
Adnane is a member of al-Queada,he poses as a cool guy but he clearly sympatise with the Ilamo-fachists.and he eliminate all liberal voices.Come on and tell us the truth,u want chria3a law in Boston too?
Don't u ever touch my whisky,I'll shoot your Islamist ass on the spot.Sure I'll get acquited for self-defense.
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2:37 am    April 6, 2004
anti_Jihad
60
Raioo is an islamite.pro-terroriste web site
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2:15 am    April 6, 2004
anti_Jihad
59
Listen Islamy boy you better delete thoses post by 7areg or Lococo especially the one in in arabic calling for jihad and killing of infidels the hated kouffars which let u live freely in Boston.You ungrateful bastard should be deported.
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11:59 pm    April 5, 2004
Outcast
58
Poverty is the result of praying to a non-existent,unproven allah 5 times a day and even more for some immoderate muzulmans.Too much waste of times.
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9:53 pm    April 5, 2004
Outcast
57
we have some genius in this forum
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8:13 pm    April 5, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
56
53
Iraq, chechenya, pakistan,palestine, jordan, afghanistan, morocco, tunisia, indonisia,egypt,......all these countries have somthg in common.

*******************POVERTY********************

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8:12 pm    April 5, 2004
mb
55
54
today in class we had an ex slave from sudan who came to talk about slavery and how he escaped from it....i don t think they target arabs and muslims in the media or in my case in the speech of this ex slave...but i got really upset when he started talking about the guy that kept him in his farm as a slave , reffering to him sometimes as the arab guy and others as the muslim guy...he didn t mean anything of course...coz this guy was really muslim and arab but the whole class stated thinking that it was allowed in our religion to have slaves ( the guy sitting next to me asked me if i had slaves at home!!! )....it s just the way they word things...they just have to be careful coz it can harm a lot of ppl...
·

6:41 pm    April 5, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
54
53
I don't think the media is focusing on Islam or targetting Islam. I don't think they're targetting us. If their headlines news are dominated by the war on terrorism, Muslim names, names of Arabic countries and towns, they can't help it, that's the news dominant these days. That's my opinion. So, I don't think anyone is feeling they're targetted, otherwise we'll be opening another can of worms, another discussion which I personnaly don't think it's worth it: war against Islam, conspiracies against Muslims, etc..

The discussion is becoming more inwards. I think some of the new questions would be are we condemning these fanatics enough? should we condemn enough? is there a better way to dealing with them? saving them?

With all sympathy to 911 victims, I think it happened to wake Muslims up to guide each other, to save each other, criticise each other and fix each other. They haven't been doing that for a long time, and were trapped in denial for decades.

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6:22 pm    April 5, 2004
Peaceful
53
Iraq, chechenya, pakistan,palestine, jordan, afghanistan, morocco, tunisia, indonisia,egypt,......all these countries have somthg in common. it is called islam. but throught history islam was tought and undesrtdood differently, thats y the islam way in morocco is different from afghanistan or bangladesh eeven tough the principles are the same, but the way is different.
we should never be on the defensive trying to justify that islam is a religion of peace. say what islam is and forget about what is not. if smbdy says so, ask him: what is the proof you have from the koran or the hadith?
you will always be right coz what he/she will say would be not correct.
therefore be proud of who u are and criminals exist in all cultures. the west as well as the east, by the way there are 2 million prisoners in the US! and a women is raped every min in the US! alarming but the focus on the media is about ure culture guys. be aware that this is not u , u are a good person with a good religion

Peace.

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12:46 pm    April 5, 2004
GwoingSoul
52
44
Subsubject: People on different levels!!

oasienne,
Those questions are not for you to answer explicitly but to probe creative and honest self exploring. I hope this makes it clearer to you.

As far as Islam goes, as I have always expressed before on this forum that Islam has been around for centuries yet very tolerant to others. History speaks for itself, the west learned from us, and we now learn from the west. No one is better than the other. In the west (mainly the U.S.), you find people who have negative views of you, your culture and religion. In the east, you find people who also have negative views (provoked or not) about the west (culture and religion). Not only that but these people (muslim extremists) are ready to blow themselves in order to kill many westerners (civilians) just because.....I don't F***ing know.....

Now where do I stand next to my religion (Islam)!! If I were to answer your questions honestly, 'Peaceful'; you would think that even though I was born and still stand in the middle of my religion, I am the fartest away from it. I am not ashamed of my position but hoping for god's guidness. I have always expressed that religion is not logical, do not try to justify or convince me logically that this religion or that religion is true simply because it (that is religion) is all about and BASED on faith. How do you acquire faith? when you find out let me know, seriously. I want faith, a tool which will allow me to answer 'Peaceful's questions more 'favorably'

How can we help fight the terrorists who are destroying our history and culture....remember in the movie "A'rissala", when Muslims had prisoners of war and treated them so kindly that the prisoners wanted to convert to Islam and some of them actually did. What happened to those values?...what happened the MOTO we grew up with in Morocco? "Wa 3amilou 2ahla Lkitabi bil 7oussnaa"
God Damn these beasts....I have words to describe those extremists that would make your mouth taste bad.... I cannot believe that 15 Moroccans are now detained in Spain for involvement in Madrid Bombing...I suggest we revoke their citizenship.....I would love to see the King of Morocco M6 to give a speach strongly condemning those individuals and revoking their Moroccan citizenship publicly...

More concerns to be unfolded and shared later.

Peace N Love

·

11:56 am    April 5, 2004

Rasta Gnawi message
51
Come on guys. Don't fall into their trap. There is nothing wrong with your religion. It's an issue of favored status club. Before religion, they blamed it on your skin color and called you savages and black feet. Now they find interest again in religion to depress you and put you down. Your glass in neither half empty nor half full; it is full and overflowing. Don't let them put a veil between you and your glass.

You will never make it into their favored status club even if you change religion, change your name, and do whatever else you think is required. They will hold technology from you, they will hold freedom from you, and they will hold your heritage against you whenever it suits them. You've got to stand tall and know what you have. Let them be the weightless leaf.

Like B Marley puts it: you can fool some people sometimes, but you can't fool all the people all the time.

Jah Bless

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10:49 am    April 5, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
50
49
MB, religion has always been a controvertial subject. It can be a light that guides people, and it can be a drug to some people putting them and others in misery. Some people are just not able to cope properly with an invisible, incomprehensible God. I think just that can confuse the heck of people turning their buttons in all sorts of combinations. Some combinations produce funny people, some scholars, some don't-cares, some indifferent, and last but not least, the fatal combination of a radical whose ends have been stretched too long, too much, he/she lost caring about the humanity of others to the extent he/she lost theirs...
·

9:26 am    April 5, 2004
mb
49
la religion en general me fait peur...je me sens mal a l aise en presence de gens pour ki le seul argument valable est la religion ...je ne parle pas que des musulmans, mais aussi juifs et chretiens...etc....la religion c est qqch de personel.
je suis pour la tolerance...chacun est libre du moment k il ne touche pas a la liberte des autres...c est simple pour moi...je n ai rien contre les extremiste du moment k ils n explosent pas ds tt les coins du monde et font des innocent.....etc...kand on reflechit ke par la religion on devient moins flexible....avec la religion c est ou blanc ou noir...en plus de ca on est meme pas suppose remettre en question le pkoi du blanc et du noir....dieu ns a donne une matiere grise k il faut pas negliger...si on l a c est pour l utiliser .....bref...je sais que notre religion n est pas celle que reflete les media tels que Fox news, Iqra....etc....je suis fiere de ma religion...je la remets en question certes....mais c est pour mieux comprendre et non pour lui trouver des failles....( quoique bon je pense ke y en a )...je pense meme que tte les religions divines sont bien ...c est l etre humain ki est mauvais de nature...mauvais et corrompu...assoife de pouvoir ..du coup il utilise la chose la plus divine pour manipuler les gens...c est pour ca k on a des gens comme benladen....
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9:24 am    April 5, 2004 This is an unrelated or foul message..
Moderate
48
ASS-Lamo Allykom
May piss (not peace) be upon you
Screw you and your Islamic revoulution
The Kouffars are more humanistic than the Islamic wackos out there.Allah also created F16,B52,and daisy cutters.
Now get lost Taliban boy
·

9:00 am    April 5, 2004

Yaz Lagouzi (Negotiator) message
47
The Prophet was right when he sid ( Kadda alfa9rou an yakouna kufran)...
·

8:25 am    April 5, 2004 This is an unrelated or foul message..
Moderate
46
ASS-lamo Alikom
May piss (not peace) be upon you
Screw you and your Islamic revoulition
The Kouffars are more humanistic than the wacko Islamists assholes.Allah also created F16,B52 and daisy cutters.
·

5:59 am    April 5, 2004
lococo72
45
asalmo alykom
when we open subject we are jsut trying just express our opinion in here dont take it personal unless the is something wrong with u
just to let u know yeah god created guantanamo but long time before that he created hell for no believers and kuffars
wasalam alykom
·

3:29 am    April 5, 2004
funny
oasienne
44
43
C'est un interrogatoire ou quoi? what , are u from the police?secret agent?
ya latif ya latif, ?a ne me donne m?me plus envie de d?battre.
·

1:19 am    April 5, 2004
Peaceful
43
ISLAM AND YOU, FACE TO FACE
who are you? what is mission or goal in life?
do you like to help others? do u help others?
do u like money? are you a cheap or generous guy?
how much do u give away from ure pay check to the poor?
do u remember God when you are happy? what about when you are sad, or in a calamity?
do u love your parents? when was the last time you asked about them?
whats ure relation with your brothers and sisters in your family?
what about ure cousins, uncles and ants? do u know them!? do u visit them, phone them?
what about ure body? do u eat well? do u do sport? how long have u stoped? do u try to eat halal food if u live in a foreign country? is it a priority for u?
what about prayer? do u pray five times a day? do u pray on time? do u go to the mosque whenever it is possible for u? do u pray in groups at home? do u do tassbih after each prayer?
how about koran? when was the last time you opened the book? read a verse, a hizb or a surat?
when you go to sleep, do u forgive those who harmed you?

PS: FOLLOW ISLAM AND YOU ARE GUARENTEED HAPPINESS FOR LIFE.

·

1:16 am    April 5, 2004
oasienne
42
17
Antr, you said exactly what i had in mind!The way of intelligence and tolerance, point barre.Infortunately l'actualit? va dans l'autre sens.
Ca me donne tout d'un coup tr?s envie de te connaitre:)
·

2:53 pm    April 4, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
41
40
I'm not sure how the word "logic" finds its place in your early post. It is very broad. I think you have a conclusion in mind and you used the word "logic" to get there. Even then you made another shortcut and focused on the computer science logic to put 911-like fanatics in a box and send them home. That's fine, it's your own reasoning, in other words, it's your own logic. May we call it the abidist logic. But observe that the abidist logic assumes things. Well such is the human logic, nothing wrong with that. we assume things. I think that is why out conclusions may not be ultimately absolute.

At any rate and "logic", my deductive reasoning responds that fanatics, or those who quickly utter kafir/non-kafir, haram/halal are not necessarily from a computer science - like logic background. If some are, we cannot say that they are interpreting religious text by nonarithmetic logic, how can you prove it? we cannot even say that if you would to apply this nonarithmetic logic to religious texts you will come out as a fanatic. I'm pretty sure that the methods and validity used in deductive reasoning in Muslim religious texts employ nonarithmetic logic. Example, If you're not in a situation where you might die out of thirst and wine is available to you, do not drink, otherwise you may drink. I'm sure there are many other examples that illustrate the guiding principles of reasoning in religious texts utilize, if not aggregate, nonarithmetic logic.

·

12:43 pm    April 4, 2004

abdelilah message
40
Logic is a wide field but I am talking abou the specificities of the mainstream logic that people study in scientifc fields like Engineering and computer science. By definition, like with algorithms, it is linear, partmentalized, specific and iconized. The logic of Tantra, Traditional Budhism and Islamic traditional Islam is nonlinear, wholistic encompassing and CONTEXTUALIZED.

Non-Fuzzy logic: A is true, non A is false
Arabic linguistic logic: Jawn= Black color and white A and non A

When you say invalid you are mentioning a validity error vs a reliability error but you never substantiated your claim. Be more SCIENTIFIC cher Adnane.

·

1:19 am    April 4, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
39
38
Skeptical, your post contained foul word and a lot of crap, and it's concealed. You also mentioned you'd like to tell FBI or CIA the posts on raioo are extremists, go ahead be my guest. If you want to view your post click above on [unrelated posts..]
·

12:28 am    April 4, 2004 This is an unrelated or foul message..
Skeptical
38
Lococo why don't u go to Iran which has chari3a law?
guess what ,Iran dosen't acccept any muslim immigrant on it's soil unless they're a terrorists.Did you know that most Iranians hate religion because it is being shoved down their throats everyday by the crazy Mollahs or Ayatollah dial zebbi.
As a matter of fact ,verywhere the chari3a was tried ,it was a disaster ,look at Afghanistan,look at Suadan,look at Nigeria, everywhere chai3a is tried it brings misery to the people.Usually poor people and women are the main victims of your damn chari3a which also violate basic human rights.

Adnane, you need to delete the hatefull messages by Lococo.this guys is tricky,in english he use moderate language but in arabic he us incitement against jews and christians and non-believer.So if you want to stay online,delete all those posts that call for hatred of non-Muslims and etc.If not I'll call the FBI or even the CIA to shut you down,believe me they have qualified arabic translators. I understand that you're based in Boston therefore you can be subject to penalties and even jail time for allowing extremists to use your web site..

·

10:34 pm    April 3, 2004
totoch
37
why mix politics with religion?...peace
·

9:56 pm    April 3, 2004
lococo72
36
31
salamo alykom
first of all i never said that we need to kick out anybody out from any country because the land belongs to allah soubhano wa taala we are just mouustghlafine fi hadih alarad and everybody should live wherever he wants too so please "?? ?????? ?? ?? ? ???"and try to read my post before you reply to it i did also said "?? ????? ?? ????? "now i will try to explain "secularism " so we can understand what we are talking about here
????????? ?? ???? ????
(secularism) ???????: ????? ?? ?????? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?????????? ??????? ??? ???? ????? ?? ????? ????? ???????? ??????? ?? ????? ???? ???? ????? ??????? ????????? ????? ???????? ???????? ?????? ?? ?????? 0
????? ????????? ??? ??? ??? ??????? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ???????? ??? 1789?? ????? ??? ????? ????????? ?? ??????? ??? ?????????? ?? ??? ?? ????? ???? ??????? ??????? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ??????? ( ?? ????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ) 0 ????? ????????? ???? ?????? ???????? ?? ???????? ??????? ?????? ?????? ??? ?????? ????????? 0
my point is and was we have to use our quran and sounna as our resource for anything in our lives. dont tell me that we need to change what's in our quran " which is what some arab leaders are doing now in their coutries so they will get the "? ?? ?????"
???? ???? ?????: {?? ???? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ??????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?? ????}
dont start talking about turkey and dump your conclusion like this one here"their political regime is successful so far"
sorry dude!! i dont see your point here also from ketab allah our quuran
i dont see why do we need to seperate our religion with our politics or our life anyway
???? ???? ?????: {???? ????? ???? ?????? ?????? ????? ????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ??? ??????}.
???? ???? ?????: {?? ???? ????? ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ???????? ?????? ????? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ????? ????????}
here something else with the proof and that's something u do see everyday everywhere in our arab world
1/ ????? ??? ???? ?????? ?????? ???? ???????:
?????? ??????? ????????? ????????? ??? ??????? ??????? ????? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ?????? ?????? ?????? ??????? ??? ????? ????? ?? ?????? 0 ????? ?? ??? ??? ?????? ????? ??????? 0
???? ??????:
??? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? * ??? ???? ??????? ???? ????
????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ??? ??? ?????? ???? ?? ????? ???? ???? ?? ???? ?? ????? ???: ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ????:" ???? ????? ?? ????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ???? ????: ??? ??? ??? ????? ???: ?? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ??????? ???? ??????? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ????: ?? ???? ???? ??? ????? ? ????: ?? ?????? ??????? ????? " ???? ??? ???????????? 0
2/ ???? ??????? ??? ???? ????????? ????????? 0 ??? ????? ???? ???????:
? ? ????? ?????? ??????? ?????? ?????? ?? ?????? ???????? ????????? 0
? ? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ????? ???????? ?????? ?????? ???????? ??????? ????? . ???? ????? ?????? ?????? ?? ??????? 0
? ? ???????? ?? ??????? ??? ?????? ??????? 0
? ? ?????? ??????? ???????? " ????????? " ?? ???? ???????? 0
3/ ???? ???????? ??????? ?????????:
??? ???????:
(Ý) ?????? ??????? ????? ????? ?? ??? ??????? ????? ????? ????? ???? ??????? ???????? ????? ???????? ??? ?????? ???? ??????? ???? ???? ??? ????????? ??? ????? ?? ??? ?????? ????? ?? ???? ????? ???????? " ???? ??? ???? ???? ?????? " 0
(?) ?? ???? ??? ??????? ?? ???? ??????? ??????? ??? ?????? ?? ?????? ??????? ?????? ?? ??????? ???? ?? ??? ??? 0
(?) ?????? ??????: ??????? ???? ?????? ????????? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ????? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ???????? ????????? ?? ???????? ?????????? ?????? ?? ????? ????? ?? ???? ???????? 0
(?) ???????? ???? ?????? ??????? ????? ??? ??????? ???????? ??? ???? ?????????? ???????? ???? ??????? ?????? ????? ?????? ???????? 0
???????? ?????? ??? ???? ????? " ??? ???? ?? ???? ??? ?? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ??????? ???? " ???? ??? ????? 124 0
also just as a reminder i would like to conclude with this point here which shows us why we are far away behind
????? ?????: ????? ?????? ???????? ????? ????? ?? ?? ??? ????????? ???????? ?????? ??????: ?????? ????? ?????? ?? ?????? ???? ?? ????? ????????? ???????? ?????? ??????: ????? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ????????? ???????? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ????
wa salamo alykom
·

7:27 pm    April 3, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
35
34
You didn't really prove what you're saying. You're saying if you study engineering, computer sceince, some doctrine that involves extensive logic, you're more prone to interpret religious texts in a fanatic way? a manner that leads to categorizing people as kafir, non-kafir, things as halal/haram? maybe lead to terrorist activity?

I cannot see from where you get the impression that studying those types of degrees means you're using a "closed binary logic". What is this "closed binary logic" anyways? From what I know, logic is a huge area of study and it's the basic layer by which every single mind operates. It's the Operating System of the mind. I think we should not confuse things and suggest that studying engineering or computer science could help produce elements of terrorism.

It's invalid.

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6:06 pm    April 3, 2004

abdelilah message
34
Hi,

I am not saying here that the west was behind the terrorist attacks or that Israel did it. That is stupid. I am saying that at a philosophical level, most of those who were involved studied in the west computer science or engineering. Their mind works with a closed binary logic of either/or (fanatic bipolarity) with which they read the religious texts and it gives halal or haram muslim or kafir. The logic of the traditional texts is not binary (jawn in arabic means black AND white...a logic that would not be accepted by standard logicians unless they are into fuzzy logic which was invented by an Iranian). See my point? le discours moderniste comme philosophie porte en lui meme les germes d'une fermeture ideologique. Les systemes anciens philosophiquement sont tolerants.

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2:47 pm    April 3, 2004
imad
33
salam
i noticed dear brothers that many moroccans go to the mosque here in FAIRFAX only during the friday prayer worse than that i have friends that only pray that day , it is really hard to understand what are they trying to do by that i guess they are just wasting their time and crowding the mosque for no reason and it is really a shame i tried to explain to them that is wrong what they are doing, well i hope they will change soon and we need to pray for our brothers too ,praying in the mosque and partying the same day in a club,drinking beers ,having sex with girls what a shame
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2:09 pm    April 3, 2004
Tarik
32
The great Moroccan Artisit Chaibia Talal has died.

Chaibia was a pilar in the contomporary moroccan art movement, known for her simple, naif and colorful paintings.

articles:

http://www.aljazeera.net/art_culture/2004/4/4-3-1.htm

http://www.menara.ma/infos/includes/detail.asp?lmodule=divertissement&article_id=2289

·

8:17 am    April 3, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
31
26
"Lococco"..."Ellah Yahdik.." on your post i don't see any example about countries who adopted secularism and got social and political conflicts...Give me an e.g....maybe you are hinting about Turkey but sorry they are more advanced and developed compared to any other arab countries the only issue they have is with Akrad and Greece (Cyprus issue), their political regime is successful sofar and very democratic if you compare it to any arab state...Prove me wrong. Malaysia as an example they are not secular but they are multi-ethnic and have other religions in the country, they are very conservative about islam but still they are moderate...Not Extremist at all...and dog-on-it they are one of the wealthy strong countries in Asia n pacifc!!!
All those countries who are ethnically diverse tends to compromise, keep their religion (with out pushing the envelope) and co-exist with other religions that does exist...it's a freedom of choice to people...Well it seems like according to ur opinion morocco has to kick-out jews or non-muslims or maybe the same thing would apply in Israel...let's just imagine your so called "doctrine" about this how the world gonna be???? (a mad house) everyone kicks out everyonelse who doesn't belong to his religion? we gonna have a new totalitarian islamist-extremist regime..same as the dictatorship of germany..."Heil Hitler again!!"...what a racial descreminatory anti-peace brain washing!!!
Sorry pal but i would bash u on this coz it's just not feasible, not accepatble and keep ur ideas for yourself...I believe the other raiooers are right since u seem to be pushing the envelope and undoubtedly yes you have an extremist tendancy...!!
I would like to mention what Dr. Farag Fouda (Who was gunned down by Islamists in 92) :"The worst thing that has plagued our nation is the entrance of the religious scholars into politics and what this led to in strange opinions and perverted thoughts," and i believe what he said was right!!
Thx.

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6:53 am    April 3, 2004
Sheikh Qotb
30
28
Tla3ti lia fi rassi... Khalini n3ish Hyati, Wehsabi M3a Rebbi ....Khalini n3ish Hyati Wehsabi M3a Rebbi.... Khalini n3ish Hyati Wehsabi M3a Rebbi ....

Fin--- Ghadi-- Biya----Khoyaaaaaa....

-Hoba Hoba Spirit

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6:13 am    April 3, 2004 This is an unrelated or foul message..
Moderate
29
In my opinion if you admire Quotb then you're and extremist and a potential terrorist.
You, Lococo and others a bunch of fanatics not welcome anywhere in the world,the West don't like you,your home countries don't want you,and uncle Oussama can't help you either,no more Afghanistan.So what you going to do Taliban boy when they come looking for you ?
Remember,Allah also created Guatanamo
·

5:53 am    April 3, 2004 This is an unrelated or foul message..
Moderate
28
I read your chilling messages both in Arabic and English.
And I piss on both of them.
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12:32 am    April 3, 2004
Peaceful
27
24
it is not you may be, but you are.
beside these talks and speeches, what is the solution or what are the solutions? this should be our focus in my view.
let me tell you what scholars say
*Focus on the future.
*Focus on the 70% that are less than 25 in the arab world.(they are the future of islam, we are the future of islam)
*Think of what you can do . example: put a link to good islamic sites from which you can enlighten any raioo visitors.
*BE a good muslim
*Help your friend to become good muslims
*Be a good citizen

If we do this we are going to be, not only among the best, but the best nation in the world. "wa2in tanssoro llaha yanssorkom" it's like 1+1=2. no doubt about it.
if only each one of us sat for while and thought about a clear and measurable goal to accomplish in his/her life that would have a good benefit for him/her and islam we are going to succeed.

PS: Remember that the darkest time during the night is the moment right before sunrise.

Peace

·

5:56 pm    April 2, 2004
lococo72
26
salam alykom
i always said and i'm saying it again i do just express my own opinion and i wasnt speaking about terrorism in my writing
dont get scared (moderate) if u saw me using arabic laungage and some of my wrinting is in arabic because i know what u think when u see somebody in morocco using arabic and of course using the word of allah to justify a topic or subject "ghwanji" because u will be using arabic language in front of god wheter you like or not even people who doesnt speak it or know it i hope u know that... i will try to prove what i said with the argument
tu ne me feras ni chaud ni froid if u believe in any others ideas or religions ???? ???? ????? (( ?? ????? ?? ????? ))
just dont come here and start insulting islam and wait for me to congratulate u for that
?? ??????? ?? ???? ????? ????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ??????? ??????? ???? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ? ??? ??? ???? ??????? ??????? ??? ??????? ??? ?? ?? ???? ???? ?????? ??? ???????. ??? ?? ??????? ?? ???? ?????? ??? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???? ????? ??????? ? ????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ? ????? ???? ?? ??????? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ??????? ????????? ????? ????? ??? ??????? ????????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ?????? ? ??? ?? ???? ?? ?????? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??? ??? ??? ??????? ?? ?????? ?? ?????? ????? ?? ????? ????? ?? ??? ???? ?????? ???????? ??????.
???? ???? ???? ?? ??????? ?? ?????? ???? ???????? ? ???? ???? ???? ????? ??? ??????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ????????? ?? ??? ??? ??????? ??? ???? ????? ???????? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????????? ???? ????
also with the proof from alhadit"????????? ?? ??????? ?????? ?? ?? ?????? ???? ???? ?????? ????? ????? ??? ???? ???? ???? ????- ?? ????: "?? ??? ?? ???? ???? ??? ????? ???? ???? ????: "??????? ????? ??????? ???????" ???? ???????(6878)? ?????(1676) ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ???? ?
and just to let uknow if u ever try to read some others religions books
??? ?? ??? ??????? [ 13 : 6 ] ??? ???? :

(( ??????? ????????? ?????? ??????? ????? ???????? ???? ??????? ???? ?????????? ???? ?????????? ??????????????? ???? ????????? ?????????? ????????: ?????????? ?????????? ??????? ??????? ????????? ?????? ?????? ???????? 7???? ??????? ?????????? ????????? ???????????? ???? ???? ???????????? ?????? ???? ??????? ???????? ????? ?????????? 8????? ?????????? ???? ????? ?????? ????????? ????? ???????? ???????? ????????? ????? ??????????? ????? ????? ??????????? ????????. ???? ??????? ??????????. ???? ?????? ??????? ??????????? ????? ?????????? ????????? ?????????. ????????? ?????????????? ?????? ??????? . . . )) ????? ???? ??????
so even others religions and believes agree
?? ??????? ?? ????? ?????? ??????? ????? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ??? ???? ?? ???? ??????? ??? ???? ??????. ??? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ? ??????? ?? ??????? ???????? ?? ????? ? ?????? ????? ?????? ????? ?????? ?????? ????????? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ??? ?? ???? ????? ???? ???????? ?????? ? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ???????
i hope we all exchange ideas,learn from each other the right thing
(p.s)
brother 7areq roddick is playing coria in the miami finals who u going for ?
wa salamo alykom

·

4:26 pm    April 2, 2004
lococo72
25
salamo alykom
first of all i'm not here to recruit anybody for anything i'm here just to learn something and to exchange my idea with other peoples ????? ?????: ??????? ???? ?????
anf then dont start accusing people for something u dont know do little search about things before u said it ok
here is little comment about yr moderation (i dont agree with any moderation of islam or something like that if u said we need to moderate islam that means u following what the ????? ??????? are trying to make u believe means also u dont have ???? ??????? ?? ???? which is something u should always be proud of there is only two ways "?????? ???????? ????? ???????" we ask allah to make us from the fallowers of the straight path


?? ????? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ????? ??????? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ??? ?????????? ????? ? ??? ?? ??????? ???????? ???? ????? ? ?????? ????? ?? ??????? ???? ???????? ? ?????? ?????? ?? ??????? ???????? ?????? ?????? ????? ?? ??? ????? ??? ???? ?? ??????? ??????? ????????? ? ???????? ??? ???? ??????? ???? ???? ?? ?????? ?? ??????? ??????? ??? ????? ???? ?? ?? ???? ??? ???? ??????? ?? ???????? ???? ????? ??? .. ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ?? ??????? ???? ?? ???? ????? ?? ???? ????? ?? ????? ?????? ?
?????? ?????????? ??????? ?? ???????? ????? ?? ?????? ?????? ?????? ? ???? ??????? ??????? ?? ?????? ???????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ??????? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ??????? ?????? .. ????? ??? ???? ?? ?? ??????? ?????? ??????? ?? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ! ??????? ???? ??? ??????? ??? ????? ????? ??????? ..
????????? ???? ?????? ?? ??? ??? ??????? ??? ????? ??? ?????? ???? ?? ??? ???? ??? ????? ??????? ?????? ?????? ???? ???? ?????????? ??? ?????? ?????? ???????? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ?????? ???????? ????????
wa salamo alykom

·

1:00 pm    April 2, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
24
23
I ask that question too, it's not very easy to answer although I'm sure there can be arguments to justify it. But I still think it is not easy to prove, and that in an ideal Muslim state of mind, none should revenge, attack and slaughter someone on the basic of the three issues Bahja brought up. If you're poor, you might end up in jail if you steal, let alone KILL someone because you're poor. Islam doesn't tell you to Kill if you're poor. Islam is innocent of that. If you're not educated, you might get dooped by someone, lose your fortune, maybe go to jail, ends up in the streets. You get frustrated, but Islam doesn't give you the green line to KILL someone. Islam is innocent of that. If you're not benefiting from any support from the "West", Islam doesn't give you la-carte-blanche to slaughter someone. You go plea your case with your community, improve it, change political leaders, do something pragmatic but not KILL someone. Islam is innocent of that.

I think of this and I can't help thinking of this example, which I'm sure is going to seem extremely controvertial to most of you, but I'll enjoy a good debate. Look at the jews in Europe, look at the holocaust. These people were publicly slaughtered and mutiliated by an ideology. How did they react to it? by suicide? by similar attacks? they kept their mouth shut, they accepted death and that of their famillies, but they went on with their lives, not with heads surrendering to life's battles. They thought, grouped, reformed themselves, and got themselves a place where they develop mighty armies to scare whoever dares to approach them, and they know that it is survival that counts. The way they play the game of life is:

Life is a big game intertwined with other games; believe nobody; come up with your own rules.

For us Muslims, we live in conflict with our religion. We'd like to follow the rules, and we'd like to break them. I'm not sure if one can say Muslims have a fortunate ideology Now. As it stands now, it is an ideology of conflict and contradictions, until y7an llah.

I may be wrong though.

·

12:19 pm    April 2, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
23
18
Abidou would u plz enlighten us and tell us how :"most of those wackos acting in the name of Islam were created by Western forces for politicized reasons"?
I don't see that correct same as what some say after 9/11 that this was masterminded by US or Israel behind the curtains which I don't really see that logical or correct...It just reminds me of the moroccan proverb "Drabni webka esbakni weshka" especially for people who have a naive presumption and does not wanna admit the truth that this whakos are arabs, saudi or middle eastern and were acting on behalf of AlQaida..
I can't believe that there is still people who can't believe the truth and are still in denial they would label it as made by western forces!!!! How?????
I really have no clue how they came up to that conclusion?
·

11:44 am    April 2, 2004
7areg
22
19
wa lamma ra'ayto al jahla finnassi fashiyan tajahalto 7atta dounna anni jahiloo.
You're the one that seems in need to straighten your facts. everybody knows the story behind the Saudis access to the throne. I meant by Saudi Arabia (" jaziratoo al 3arab")
Why do you have to label me as a terrorist. why do u have to use terms that u don't even understand their appropriate usage. why don't u give us some examples of your so called Moroccan version of islam?? r u a moderate ? how do u define moderate. where do u stand on this issue ???
Ajssamoo al bighal wa 3oo9ool al 3assafire
Nasser was no angel he killed sayed Koutb because he felt that his position was menaced. Mr know it all, I got another question for ya
Who helped Nasser rise to power ??
I am Muslim and I don't believe in Moderate, semi-moderate, 1/4 moderate... BS
we don't believe In violence, we believe in freedom , and whatever is in the Koran and the Sunnah ( sa7i7 al 7adith) is true. Omar ibn al Khattab said: "Na7nou 9awemoun a3azzana allahou bil islam, fa in ibtaghayna al 3izzata fima dounahoo addalana allah"
It is easy for you to call me extremist and terrorist, however; if I call you "Safihe" or crazy ur gonna start jumping up and down like a frog
anyways .....
salam
·

8:51 am    April 2, 2004
FZ
21
I Just want to give props to Antar, well done. I do think that islam is religion of tolerence and understanding but honestly, this past few years all you hear about islam is terrorism, killing, mistreating women, intolerence. I'm not loosing faith but sometimes i wonder is this really what islam stands for now. How come there are less poeple who think like Antar and me than the fanatics and the radicals. I just hope that one day the image of Islam will be restored.
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8:09 am    April 2, 2004
Bahja
20
I can't disagree Antr, and I hope Adnane will get this straight.
bosse 3ammou o raddo lemmo
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7:19 am    April 2, 2004
Moderate
19
16
Seeking wisdom from terrorists? wallah hadi zwina
Sayeed Quotb is considered the Godfather of modern Islamists'terrorism,he declared the whole contemporary society as Kaffirs,that's why president Nasser sentenced him to death.And the so-called saudi scholas,are also a bunch of intolerant wahabbi who inspired Bin Laden.An tthe conpanions of the prophet (pbuh) were not SaudisFor your information Saudi Arabia is a modern creation by Al Saud familly.Al-Saud familly got rich familly got rich and powerful especially by robbing cravans during the Haj season.That was before the discovery of oil.So get your facts straight dude,before coming here to spread terrorist propaganda on this forum.My question again why are specifically quoting Sayeed Quotb and some wahabbi scholars calling for the death of non-believers??? Are u recruiting for theses jihadis groups on this site?
·

5:27 am    April 2, 2004

abdelilah message
18
al hamdulillah that Allah made us Muslims and we should in no way doubt our religion because of the acts of some sick people for two main reasons:
most of those wackos acting in the name of Islam were created by Western forces for politicized reasons.
Islam has always had its fanatic fringes mentioned by our beloved prophet (khawarij for example) saying about them that even if they outdo anybody in prayer they will deviate from Islam kama yamruku sahmu mina ramiyya. Same with the very narrow tribal wahhabi ideology.
·

4:25 am    April 2, 2004

Antr McShaddad (Yahia.L) message
17
Terrorism is terrorism regardless of the terrorist's religion .
How ever, I think that the conflict Israel-Palestinian played one of the major roles in the rise of Islamic fundamentalism as well as extremism since the 60s...

Muslims find themselves trapped between the nostalgia of a glorious past, and the humiliations they have gone through since colonialism until recent wars and defeats(Palestine, Chechnya, Iraq, Bosnia etc...) by other countries who happen to be "Christians" by large...

Poverty, lack of education and confusion, makes certain youths perfect candidates to be recruited by the terrorist groups.
Lately, it has been proven that Morocco seem to offer such candidates for some reasons that I cann't fully grasp.
I guess the fact that Morocco is a young multicultural society, with chalenges and limited resources, where tradition and modernism are combined, where the first steps toward democracy have just been introduced, that creates confusion for those who live upon imported sect doctrines from the East such as Wahabism , Salafism etc ... and as a result, they see enemies everywhere, and life on earth becomes irrelevant...

The way I see it is that, justice is not a monopoly of Islam nor Christianity, nor Hinduism.
In other words, I can get my legal share in Japan or New Zealand and may not have it in Saudi-Arabia, Iran or Brazil.
The Salafists refuse to negotiate with anything that doesn't have an Islamic label on it. They want to rebuild everything from scratch, the Andalusi way (Salihon li kolli makan wa zaman), while they have no objective plan how to implement what they claim to be perfect laws to the 21 century .
How will they deal with the IMF, world bank, the stock markets, and all the businesses and industries ? since they all deal with Riba (interest rate) , which I don't encourage by have no power over it ... If you put any commodity or currency in the world under the microscope, you will realize that Riba is involved directly or indirectly...How can
the muslim nations chelenge that, when most of the illeterate and malnutrited people exist in muslim countrie ?

A Shia Muslim believes in different laws than the Sunni Muslim. the first wants to include Zawaj Al mot3a (Pleasure marriage) , the second wants to celebrate the prophete's birthday while the Wahabists claim that is a Bid3a !
Every one of them has his arguments and Ahadiths, and everyone is accusing the other of not being accurate...

That's one reason among many why I favor the LAW of the LAND to rule over them all , otherwise animosity will remain between the different fractions. let alone the rest of the religious minorities, or people who have weak or no faith...
the other reason is that, the law of the land can be criticized and even changed if people are not too happy with it.
while the religious leaders... if they would take over the power, you can not negotiate with them. because they claim that they rule by the rules of God, and if you are not too happy with that, then throw yourself in the ocean because you are just a kafir anyways... and that is the dilemma the Saudis and Iranians are trapped in.

The way the modern world is running is corrupt an unfair, that is abvious, but it is too little to late to change the world without triggering a world war...In which we would lose Big time, for the obvious reasons!
I believe that Islam has become a target for many poeple with bad intentions...some want to eradicate it by accusing every muslim, some take adventage of the situation and want to impose their
outdated radical islamic views claiming that is it for the benefit of the Umma, while they are just adding more heavy load on a exausted camel who is already Mtoutesh.

Maybe a change will happen 300 years from now...maybe once this western civilization will collapse, some wise guy somewhere will rise up a better idea about how to run a world based on something else than profit ...
But since we are in the 21 century, let's live it and learn what good it has to offfer, God wants us to do that, otherways he would have created all of you Raioosters in the middle ages . ;)

I am a Muslim and I am proud of it, but I do not follow any organized religious fraction...my religion is mine.
I read what others wrote, but it is up to my head to make a decision. nobody can or should make that decision for me!
I try to invest in the hear after by following the basic teachings of Islam, I try to become a better muslim in my own way... I try to help when I can, forgive when I can...
I do not judge nor get impressed by a person skin color, nationality, religious etiquette's, sex, or dress code...I respect other people's choices, and I defend the idea that no one should have the right to put his nose in other people's business.
I believe in Freedom with basic morals...but I know that there is always a price for that .
I have friends who are Muslims, others are Christians (people here don't pay much attention to religion) others do not believe in God...I believe that a person can be a compassionate with high morals regardless of his religious background...( a Muslim can be a criminal, an Atheist can be a doctor helping poor kids in Africa, and Christian can be a Bush or a Hitler and vise versa)
I believe religion can not stop a person from living a normal life...I had the same opinion even while living in Morocco.
I reject censorship and extremism in all of its forms and and shapes...would it be religious or political .

My religion stands for Tolerence and Peace.
Does that make me a descent Muslim in the eyes of God, I hope it does...

·

4:20 am    April 2, 2004
7areg
16
14
Islam doesn't belong to Morocco, Au contraire, Morocco belongs to Islam. a Muslim is supposed to seek wisdom wherever he/she finds it. What r your sources ??? since when, we judge people by what they play on fox,CNN ...etc
well I am waiting for a quote of some Moroccan scholar that disagrees with what was stated.
1-who gives us the right to label this one a terrorist and that one as a moderate?? may be because many are living in the US and drive cars with a consumption of 20 Gallons/mile... is that how u define a moderate Muslim ?? or do we start making your own moderate fatwas ??? How different is that from bin landen ??? same approach, same logic
2- The "Malikite doctrine" was imam malek from Morocco ?? Our beloved prophet and his companions were all from Saudi Arabia.

what is the point ??? and please provide proofs and justify what you say, @ least find a different source from Fox news

·

3:05 am    April 2, 2004
Kamal
15
Salam,
est ce que c'est vrai cette nouvelle la : que le Maroc est entr? en guerre avec sa voisin L'algerie :?

http://www.marocinfo.net/to/news.php?lng=fr&pg=584

??

·

10:57 pm    April 1, 2004
Moderate
14
Have you guys noticed that Lococo is an extremiste,first he quoted Sayeed Quotb as a respectable Muslim scholar.Sayeed Quotb is an an Egyptian who is considered to be the phylosopher of Islamic terrorism,he was the founding father of a group called "Takfir wal Hijra"more extreme than the Muslim brotherhood.The "takfrir wal hijra" think they have the right to declare other fellow Muslim as Kuffars and then kill them.Quess what! our iminent scholar Sayeed Qotb was sentenced to death by Nasser.Then he was prompty execused at the gallow.
As of the 2nd so-called scholars,is Saudidi Wahabbi who considers Moroccans and others moderate s Muslims as true Muslims.That's the Satanic sect behind Bin Laden madness.
I'm just asking why this guy Lococo can't find a Moroccan scholar to quote? Isn't Moroccan are supposed to follow the Malikite doctrine? mm I smell a rat here
No wonder we have suicide bomber and terrorists among us.
·

10:26 pm    April 1, 2004
Bahja
13
Poverty + illeteracy + colonialism = Arab (muslim) world + violance.
Also the fact that arabs think that they are smarter than the west (from the history) makes it hard for them to accept defeat. This lead to things like suicide bombing, 911...
I think that the West is responsible for this violance to some extent. If there were no Israel-Palestine conflict, if there were no colonialism things could have been better.
When you said there is poor poeple in America, what do you mean? poverty alone is not a driving force... you need more than that: you need to invlove diffrence in religion or beleive and culture, then poverty, education, someone to blame and lastly pride!

Cheers Adnane

·

9:26 pm    April 1, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
12
11
You said: In stead try to explain to people in this nice country the real motivation of violance in Muslim country (poverty and lack fo education and lastly absence of support from The West).

poverty: poor people exist in every country, even in the US. In Muslims countries you find rich people, not-so rich, average people also. So how would the mild poverty (as compared to some African countries) somehow play into today's feelings towards Islam.

lack of education: yes a lot of people in Morocco for example are illiterate, but they're not all involved in a war, a resiatnce, global attacks.. are they? how do you connect lack of education to today's feelings towards Islam.

absence of support from the west: so in order to ease up today's feelings towards Islam, Muslims only need some help from the west? what kind of help?

Also I presented the discussion to ask questions that I imagined different people could be asking nowadays but feeling uneasy to voice out. They are controvertial questions that require quiet a bit of critical thinking and reading. If someone is in doubt that's a good start. Nothing wrong with it. I think Rast garcia recommendations were on point. It'll be very helpful for individuals to read Quran, history, contexts, as opposed to limiting oneself to repeating headline news.

·

8:52 pm    April 1, 2004
Bahja
11
The topic is very relevant however the way it is presented is a bit skeptical.It is like someone who is i doubt! Or it is juts if you saying that all muslims are having a desire to be terrorist! I think the real truth is the fact that most muslim countries happen to be poor at this era, adding to that the lack of supports from Western world. Poor countries have high illeteracy rates that explain the violance and the willingness to go against the western world. America soes not help the situation by going to an unjustified war with a muslim country, neither does Israel. You should not feel ashamed or uncomfortable of being muslim in USA, and I do not agree that that muslims should feel bad for what other muslims are doing. In stead try to explain to people in this nice country the real motivation of violance in Muslim country (poverty and lack fo education and lastly absence of support from The West).
·

7:11 pm    April 1, 2004

Adnane Ben. message
10
9
Well I was talking about the parameters that first created "the war on terrorism" and the parameters that are strenghtening it now. These parameters show up as people who blow up themselves, use planes, bombs etc. and it is no coincidence that they are "Muslim". The source of these parameters may still be unknown to a degree, but it has been traced to or motivated by Al Qaeda vision. This vision is led by people who have a Muslim heritage and background, a movement that is built on ideologies claimed to be "Muslim" ideologies. Al Qaeda or the ideologies inspired by Al Qaeda, I sense, are about to become to the non-Muslims what Zionism is to the Muslims. Zionism is probably a taboo topic of discussion among Jews. Do you think Al Qaeda or its children ideologies are becoming a taboo among Muslims to discuss, question and resist?

So let's probably not bring up examples of good scholars from the past to clean up today's feelings towards Islam. Let's bring today's so-called spiritual leaders to the spotlight and clearly question how they are shaping up the feelings towards Islam.

·

2:34 pm    April 1, 2004
Peaceful
9
you say if you live in the past you dont live the present, the fact is that we are the result of our history!
let me give u this motto: yesterday is history, tomorrow is a vision, today is a gift that y we call it the present.
but messio 3antara bno chadad, adnane was talking about your faith after the bombong we ahear about hear and there... what i am saying is that underestimating urself because of this is useless. why? because i said islam is a religion of success, it is a religion of well being, in fact it is a way of life that lead you toward happiness. and i gave examples to recent and ancient scholars that we should know and be proud of. we should even imitate in the fact that they have excelled in what they do. i wish one day i will hear about antar being a prominent guy in something:)
so ill be proud of you and we will have a subject just about antar and his secret of success:)
now the subject raises others quetiosn that have to do with faith. and faith gos up and down and it is a journey in which we need to remind ourselve that we can always succeed even if we fall. the failure is when you stop trying
khokom kane hena

wassalam:)

·

12:25 pm    April 1, 2004
lococo72
8
salamo alykom
???? ?????? ?????? ???? (?) : ???
????? ???? ??? ?????? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ???????? ????????? ?????????).???? ???? ?????

??????? ????? ???? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ?????? " ??? ???? ?????? (??????? 58) ????? ??????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ??????? ??? ???? ?? ??? ??? ??? ??????? ??????? ???????? ??? ???? ??????? ????????? ???????? ?????????? ?? ???? ? ???? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ???? ???? ?????? ??????? ?????? ?????? ???? ??? ???? ??? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ??? ??? ????? ?????? ????? ???? ??? ????? ??? ??? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ?????? ??????? ?????? ?????? ?????? ????? ??? ?? ??? ???? ??? ???? ??? ??? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???????? ?? ?? ????? ? ???? ???? ?? ??????? ????? ??????? ??????? ?? ???? ???? ??? ?????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ? ???? ???? ????? ?? ???? ??? ???? ??? ???? ????? ???? ????? ????? ??????? ?????
i do believe in my religion "islam " i'm proud of being a muslim no matter what others think
like my bother 7areg we all make mistakes everyday but with the quide and the help of allah and ourselves we will be inchallah from ??? ?????
? ??? ????? "??? ??? ?? ??? ?? ?? ??? "???? ???? ?? ??? ?? ??? ?? ?? ???? ?? ??? ?? ?? ??? ??????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ?? ??????
i had some comment about what was said about islam and our prophet mohamed (?) from some poeple in here
here is an answer from ??? ?????? ?? ???? ??????
??? ???? ??????? ?????? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ?????????
????? ???.
????? ???.
?? ????? ? ??? ???? ???? ????- ??? ?? ????? ????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ??? ??? ??? ???? ???? ??? ??? ????? ???????? ??? ?????? ? ??? ???? ???? ????- ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ????? ??? ???? ????? ????? ???? ?????? ????? ?? ?????? ??? ??? ????? ??????? ????????? ??? ??? ????? ????? ???? ????? ???? ???? ????? ??? ??? ????? ???? ??? ??????? ?????????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????- ??? ???? ??????? ???????? ????? ???? ???? ?? ??????? ???? ?? ????? ????? ? ??? ???? ???? ????- ??? ??? ????? ??? ??? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????? ????????? ?? ??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?????? ??????? ??? ???? ???? ????- ???? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ???? ?? ??? ??? ?? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????? ??? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????- ?? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ??? ???? ? ?? ????? ?? ???? ??? ????? ? ??? ???? ???? ????- ???? ??? ???? ???? ??????? ??? ????? ?? ???? ??????????? ??? ?????? ????????? ?? ?????? ?? ????? ??? ????? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ??? ??? ???? ????? ?????? ?????? ???? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?????? ?? ???? ??????? ?? ?? ?? ???? ????? ??? ?????? ? ??? ???? ???? ????- ??? ???? ?? ???? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?? ????? ???? ???? ???? ????-? ??? ???? ????? ???? ???? ???? ???? ? ??? ??? ???? ??? ???? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ??????? ????????? ????? ???????? ????? ????\
i do suggest to some people (educate people ) i mean if u want to say something wrong and bad about islam and our prophet dont think if u said it in here nobody will react we will and we will show u how we feel about it
there is moment on everyday we should think about
we have to ask ourselves now if we did wrong or good things
and of course in the far back of your mind we know what's wrong and what's right and we should do something to correct it which is "??? ??????"
may allah accept from me and all of you
wa salamo alykom

·

8:46 am    April 1, 2004
Baghi-Tiqar
7
First and foremost this subject is very pertinent and to the point, Thx Adnane for your craftsmanship, in creating or assisting in bringing up subjects that touches sorrow, laughter, and some important concerns to everyone: moroccans and muslims..
Most of us were thaught discipline and Koran and Hadith and Islamic education in Jamaa (I won't call it kindergarten) or primary school..etc.. but we feel like it was the necessary obligation to learn stuff by heart and get that superficial knowledge to prepare you to be a muslim unless we specialize in that field. We grow up and and ideas and questions grow bigger and complexed with us? which way we have to follow? sometimes we are "lost in translation" not of words but of interpretations of the book or facts, TV, what people say etc.
I believe most of us lacked a certain enlightment about the other (Western word) coz it was depicted as bad and obscene as much as you can imagine...Judaism and Christianity were seen from a different dimension and we were to take that at a certain age for granted. We needed some relief and the best relief it was to start understanding and learning about things all over again in a mature way not as a school kid!
to say the least, i was victimized by being thaught that way..coz fkih has nothing to offer, Imam has nothing to offer but attending "Gsaai dyal kesksou" as well as the teacher who was already burnt out with "elbayd owmaticha" and the daily booring lectures, they were all true streotypes of our society and the main sources that bridges the gap between an innocent kid and a molded pre-fabricated muslim (I am not meaning a product...but a character). Bottom line, when i reached a certain age i felt we have to have the opportunity to evaluate, read, assess and understand and then decide the right path. It's a matter of freedom, democracy and maturity, that was the solution and the resolution for me personally.
I felt so bad for what happened on sept 11 like every other citizen of the US, coz it touches innocents and was an act of unadmissible, unacceptable mass-killing from a bunch of idiots. The image of the muslim was put on the spotlight and was questionable. Although i'd never witnessed any hatred or act of segregation from my co-workers or the people i deal with in daily commute...but there was an implicit feeling of guilt deep-down even if we have nothing to do with this.The million-dollar question was is Islam like that? Does Islam incite for such foolish irrational acts? and of course i was determined as every righteous person to say "No" to those allegations.
I have to say that I like Islam in different instances but i still have questionable matters that i don't accept as a free, liberal and democratic person ( I don't think i have room for it in this discussion right now) in the meantime I respect all other religions fairly.
I saw a lot of friends that were in self-denial coz they don't have the argumentative base to defend themselves or they are not sure ...although i saw it just a matter of reflecting the real image of yourself..maybe of goodness, you don't need to have a "aamama" and "Jellaba" and a beard to be a good muslim, what you need just to have a true honest good behavior, attitude, respect to yourself and others.
Goodness is reflected in the person's attitude, principles, openness, consciousness and RESPECT!!!
We have to lead by example and avoid all act of : flattering too much ourselves referring to Ibn Taimia or Bokhari or "It's us who created the zero" and Ibno Naffis' Medicine etc.. all that I consider it superfluous shady historical images that most people try to hide behind which i have to mention that is true and re-iterate that those people were great but self-assess yourself, what do we have now Just "zweil" noble prize holders ...that's it???
I know there's lot of people against westernization but that's the key for getting moving...and here i mean being civilized, modern, organized, democratic (Not Platon kingdom) but we have to get the beneficial side from the other world (West), and learn the best practices in the meantime not loosing the core of Islam which is peace, "Al-Akhlaq"...we have just to be who we are (peaceful people) and lead by example that's it!!
finally; It was said "Innama el-omamo alakhlaqo ma baqiat..in hia dahabt akhlaqohom dahabo..." thanks
·

7:45 am    April 1, 2004

Rasta Gnawi message
6
Dudes... you can't follow nor defend what you don't know. You can't come to peace with what you don't know. You can't get upset with what you don't know, although most people do.

My suggestion to all you raioosters: read 2 pages of the quran everyday. Understand them a little. Understand the historical context of those pages. Then let your mind respond as its nature dictates. I would recommend starting with surat Aal 3emran. It will give context to your reading, especially given nowadays' event. Don't jump to the easy short last surats unless you're willing to specialize on post death events.

Read it, reject it or accept it, then be proud of your decision.

Allah bless

·

6:20 am    April 1, 2004
observant

Antr McShaddad (Yahia.L) message
5
3
Who told you that I didnt like the fact that Al khawarizmi was a muslim? Avoid false assumptions and fast judgements, and there is no need to get defensive ...
The topic is not about glorifying Islam nor about bashing it . It is about how do you, as an individual X, see Islam and how do you relate to the Muslims now in this CURRENT DAYS OF THE TWINTHY FIRST CENTURY !!! nothing more, nothing less...

If you keep living in the past, you will be missing the present ...

·

5:37 am    April 1, 2004
7areg
4
In the name of Allah
May Peace be upon y'all
I am very proud of my submission to Allah. Although we all commit sins ( on a daily basis) I live with the hope that eventually I will surpass all the obstacles and repent once and for good. I see what's happening to the Muslims as a test, a message from the Almighty Allah to wake us up and a fulfillment of a prophecy of our beloved prophet Mohamed MPBUH, that said that all the nations will gather up against muslims to the point that they will invite each other -against us- like somebody invites his/her friend to a feast.

on the other hand I got nothing to prove to anybody? I was as astonished and mad as Americans were in 9/11 and I am as disgusted and sad as all muslims when the US decided to massacre so many Afghanis, Iraqi and if we had oil, they would have been across the altlantic ( that would have saved them some money.. i guess )
I am proud, have dignity and true, I do not feel no guilt or shame or anything of the like whatsoever.
Yes I do find myself as one of the Muslims
Who am I to judge a religion revealed by Gabriel to Mohamed MPBUH from ALLAH, I am always in peace with my religion I am always able to defend my religion, I grew up as a muslim, however; I rediscovered Islam with the help of Allah, in these times of Testing? I am gaining faith getting closer to the mosque? discovering great stuff about my glorious religion ISLAM

·

1:46 am    April 1, 2004
Peaceful
3
2
what about muslim on the ground? what do you have to say beside not liking the fact that there were muslim scholars such as alkhawarizmi, alghazali and jabir bno hayyane as well as the nobel prize winner ahmed zawel?
we wish you can help us with some insights

Peace

·

12:13 am    April 1, 2004
An
2
1
Let's talk about regular muslims on the ground who represent the vaste majority, not about a muslim nobel prize winner or an exceptional muslim thinker .

If Cheb Khaled was a nobel prize scientist, you would have had no idea what kind of muslim he was...and maybe a Salafi Jihadi would have use his name to back up his argument ...
Let's not hide behind exceptional figure, and face the actual facts as they are... I still want to hear individual replies where I can feel a person's individual opinion, instead of typing independant religious quotes and dogmas.

·

9:04 pm    March 31, 2004
Peaceful
1
Thanks for bringing such an important subject in such a sensitive time. in fact all the questions you raised i believe are asked by many muslims around the world today and try answering them is a good thing to do...
we have evrything to be proud of and nothing to be ashamed of. look at the history of pple who followed islam, Jabir ibn Hayyan, Al-razi, Almajriti all these scholars promoted chemistry on there time and they were the head of this science in the world...even today the nobel prize in chemestry in 1999 is a muslim named Ahmed Zawel who made a marvelous descovery, he got his bachelor degree in egypt. he is a muslim, a scholar and believe in Allah and Mohamad as a prophet.
suffering from the inferiority complex should not be for us because we are "khayera ommatine okhrijate linnass ta2morona bilma3rouf wa tanhawena 3ani lemonkar" the condition is doing good and asking pple to do so and banishing evil.

You are Muslims....Your prophet is Mohamad and your Lord is ALLAH.

be positive .......love yourself and love others and by being a good muslim in your community especially with non-muslims you are gona send a great image about ure religion and pple will respect you regardless of whomever want to create a lie about your islam

Peace.

·

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What a complicated war! what a warm music!..
Can Anthropologists and Social Scientists Help Prevent or St..
Moderate Muslims: What Does it Mean?..
Craigslist Accordion..
Royal Air Maroc: Deal or No Deal?..
You mean people in politics do not necessarily have universi..
Morocco Pays Full Repatriation Fees of a Deceased?..
A Bottom Line or a Red Line Petition?..
Michael Moore On The Planned Islamic Center in New York..
Middle Eastern Gnawa..
Islamophobia on the Rise in America? ..
Heavy Metal Morocco..
The Maghrib that I love..
Some Congressman Blows Up Over National Debt..
Moroccan Avatars I..
The Saidia Beach in Morocco is Angry!..
My Squared Kufi: Family ..
Spiritual Poems Performed by Moroccans..
Palestinian Avatar..
Gmail Buzz..
The Saviors of Humanity in the 21st Century: McAfee of the S..
 
2009
Moroccan Turns Waste into Effective Use..
:) سبب توقف ا..
The Charter To Dismantle The Arabs..
Abd Al-Qadir Al-Jilani: On The Meaning of Ritual Worship and..
A Perspective on Woman Virginity: Sheikh Khaled Al-Joundi..
WHY IS the Arab world -- let us speak with terrible sharpnes..
Lammalless Lands Again Yet Another Funny Video ;) ..
Free-spirited Young Moroccans..
Georges Moustaki: Le Métèque..
Wali of Oujda Giving Students a Final Exam on the First Day ..
Modern Morocco Lives Off Old Baraka..
Algeria Unleashes Its Sitcom Wings: Jam3i Family..
Human Tetris: I haven't laughed like this in a while! :)..
La7kaam Game Japanese Style..
Nedjim Bouizoul: The Gypsy Maghrabi Genre is Born..
Follow raioo's twittering zawej..
Mostapha Skandrani: The Mozart Chaabi Virtuoso..
USAID Opportunity in Morocco..
Urban Road Biking: America Takes On a New Passion!..
Michael Jackson: May God Bless You Brother..
Kesang Marstrand and Khobz Sh3ir..
Lesson of Respect..
تـلـمسـا..
Will Morocco's Saidia Beach Survive? Fadesa = Fade7a ~..
The First Moroccan Parliament Representative of Moroccans in..
How To Cook Bibi ..
Nouria El Yacoubi From Figuig: Moroccan Champion of Karate C..
Akhir Phenomene Maghribi F Miricane..
Moroccan Behavior Towards Law Enforcement: A Car Boot Case S..
I Play Soccer (El'Foot) Like a Binocular-Equipped Japanese ..
Moroccan Weddings Under One Roof..
Government Motors Propaganda, But Still Better Than McCain..
BAC 2009..
My Dream Gadget..
The Future Of Cigarettes Looks Brightly Blue..
Dialogue with a Moroccan Farmer Faqir (1975 Kevin Dwyer)..
Nador and Hashish..
Please Complete Survey about Language Code-switch..
Moussier Tombola: Dédicasse au Maroc..
Become Who You Are ~ Nietzsche..
ABDERRAHMANE PACO: THE LEGEND..
From Torino to Morocco..
Morocco Therapy..
Sourate Arrahmane in Kabyl Berber..
Deux Zach C'est La Guerre, Attention Le Loup Est Revenu.. FO..
Bird-Men ~ Any Moroccans Dare?..
From The Treasures Of Arabic Morphology: Min Kounouzi Assarf..
Words of Advice From A Moroccan Sheikh..
Sheikh Party? Sadaqa? Entertainment? Serious Worship? What i..
Boston 5K Race/Walk To Send Medical Equipment To Morocco..
Muslim in SLAMI ~ MY RESPECT!..
What is Saved of My Old Animation Archive: Sheikh Wins!..
Sala Morocco's Cha3bana et La Tradition Du Malhoun..
WOW! The Most Beautiful Moroccan Song of 2009 by Malhoun X..
Great American Public Entertainment in Paris: Street Dancers..
My Interview About The Role of The Internet in The Life of M..
Tai Chi Semlalia: Classic Moroccan-dubbed Martial Arts Film..
Nice Songs About Henna Tradition in North African Weddings..
Oujdawood is Whipping Some Film Ass!..
Houari Manar: A Rising Star, A Gloomy Rainbow For Others..
Why Did Boston's MACCA Drop The Moroccan in MACCA?..
Moroccan Mobile Consulate: Boston March 21-22, 2009..
Why Mother Damia Has a Moroccan Tatoo and a Jewish Innoculat..
Do you love me? do you, do you?..
James Brown's Cape Finale (Boston, MA '68)..
James Brown: Please, Please, Pleeeease.. and Nomore Trivial ..
Obaid Karki: British Depravity in Dubai Sex-On-Beach..
حلاقة الم..
Raioo Speaks Arabic: Type in Arabic Without A Sweat!..
How To Type in Arabic Using Your Keyboard for Windows..
ATMAN: Algerian Batman Spoof..
Is Hollywood Abusing Morocco?..
Abdelkader Secteur: L3id Lekbir..
Abdelkader Secteur: Kelb wel 7mar 7ashakoum!..
Pro-Israel Rally Features Low IQ..
How is the economy crisis in the west affecting Morocco?..
Nice Programming from elmuhajer.com: The Culture of Immigrat..
Libyan Soccer Video Game Star in the Making..
Obama's Stimulus Package Already in Effect in Morocco..
Bush and the Mysterious Handshakes..
Never Get a Police Ticket Again!..
Middle East, USA and Israel As seen By Michel Collon..
 
2008
Gaza 2008 Crisis: Is Winning the Heart of the Eagle The Answ..
Islam and The Current Economic Crisis..
If Only Obama Picks Peter Schiff As Special Advisor..
Beat Box Man From Doukala..
I Don't Trust Moroccan Officials: Why?..
So You Think You Can Dance Like a Moroccan Gypsy?..
My First Moroccan Almond Truffles!..
Cooking with Alia..
Town Hall Meeting in DC Regarding MAC (Moroccan American Coa..
Highlights of a Meeting: El Yazami President of the Council ..
Please Donate For Mariam: A Cancer Child in Boston from Iraq..
Congratulations Barack Obama!..
American 401k and Moroccans..
Mounib Feeling Well and on TV..
A Beautiful Moroccan Quran Recitation by Abdel Hamid Hssayn..
Tzawaj Magalha Liya Grows Wings!..
How to eat a watermelon..
Looking for US-based Travel Agent to book a flight or tour t..
Drop Down Pants! ..
Muslims in America: An Experiment...
Buy From Your Local Farmers Market !..
Yassir Chadly: An Inspiring Multi-dimensional Moroccan in Am..
Moroccan Club Dance Night: 30+ Proper Attire Brown Camel-ski..
Conversations About La7rig (Illegal Immigration)..
Shakira Wa Akhawatouha..
Moul Taxi: A Trip to the Airport..
Morocco on Bizzare Foods with Andrew Zimmern..
Hanane Fadili Strikes Again..
Freedom of Expression According to Raouf Ben Yaglane..
Cheikha Djennia & Cheikh Djilali Tiarti..
My Taste of a Christian Moroccan Interfaith Dialogue..
Angels singing Allah Ya Moulana by Nass Elghiwane..
A Call From Algeria to Help Suffering Little Boy Mounib!..
La Secheresse... de l'internet et de ezzehar..
Parents and Family from the perspective of an immigrant..
Do you want to Volunteer Abroad? VOLUNTEER in Morocco ~ Sign..
Moroccan Playing Cards Game ronda v1.0..
Sid El-Miloud 2008: Koul 3am Wentouma Bkhir..
NEW: Raioo Groups..
Call to Moroccans in Greater Boston: Help Provide Meals For ..
Moroccan American Television Program..
A promotional video for the Al Huda Summer Camp in Maine..
Une compo intitulée Alger..
Sidi Mohamed Ouali (Ou3li): Berber..
Moroccan Amazigh girl name "illy": DENIED...
What's That Song in the Kia Spectra Commercial?..
A Beautiful Burda Recitation!..
 
2007
In Memory of My Father-in-law, Si La7bib..
Al-Qaeda Freak Show in North Africa..
The Girl Who Picked Up A Moroccan Rose..
Les Oiseaux De Figuig!..
Paul Bowles: A Witness of Moroccan Traditional Storytelling..
Mick Jagger of Algeria!!..
ZOGO: Rock Fusion Hailing from Algeria Lalaland!..
Cheb Mami, The Fugitive Prince!..
Local Moroccan Businesses, freelancers and services Deserve ..
From Los Angeles to Casablanca!..
Halloween SPECIAL 2007: La Mort D'une Souri!..
Looking for a Moroccan folkloric harvest hymn....
Allah Made Me Funny @ Boston..
MPK20: Sun's Virtual Workplace..
Morocco Mall 2010: Largest Shopping Mall of North Africa..
U.S. House Passes Historic Ramadan Resolution..
Looking for Arabic or French to English Translator..
Dr. Hassan Al-Turabi..
My Top 5 List of Quran Recitors 2007..
Samurai Jack of Algeria..
This Moroccan Barry! and his Baraka Men La3yaqa..
Doodling: Sheikh L7ouma..
How Moroccans Put Together a Government..
Hillareous Cat Wrestles Mouse claymation!..
ABSOLUTE RAIOO Summer 2007 Rai vol.2..
ABSOLUTE RAIOO SUMMER 2007 RAI Vol 1..
Oujda Folkloric Musicians after a long day....
Iwighd Adar by Amarg Fusion !!!!..
Alalla Yallali ft. Nabila..
Jews Support the Boston Mosque..
The a la Menthe: Maghreb French RAP..
Ya Ghrib !..... ft. Khaled, Lamine, Rai NB..
Hazzou Bina La3lam: Hajja Hamdaouia!..
Ha Elkass 7loo: Hajja Hamdaouia ft. Hamid..
Boston Moroccan Tennis Club: Mini Tournament 2..
Sidi Hbibi by Mano Negra - the unexpected :)..
Le Bachir ..
Cheb Mami.. L'ancien :) Pas Le Nouveau :(..
Summer Hidden Stress..
Fanfaraï - Rai Cuivre !..
Darouha Biya Mchaw L'Mekka w'Khallawni..
CHEB ANOUAR!..
Zoo Event Organized by Al Huda..
Navigating post-divorce..
Just what is Civic Engagement?..
To Fly Boston <-> Morocco or Not..
Meetings with Moroccan Consultative Council on Human Rights..
J'irais dormir chez vous au Maroc..
Support Morocco Autonomy Initiative to solve the Sahara issu..
Les Frères Zergui..
On the Word "Plethora"..
When The Moors Ruled In Europe..
Ya Rassoul..
BARRAKA duet Cheb Khaled & Chebba Zahouania..
Cheba Zohra & Mahadattes de Rilizane..
SKyouz Me While I Light My Spliff!..
HAMIDOU, Algeria's Playboy!..
First mnanauk. Then mahdisean!..
Karima Skalli, Nassima et Leila Hejaiej..
Rym Hakiki: Matsalni Ma Ansalek..
The Road To Guantanamo..
Matejebdoulich by Djenet..
Cuban Chaabi! Guantanamera!!..
Hadj Menouer: El Batoul !..
Parske Ana Nebghi Wahran Bezzaf!..
I declare Moe a Star!..
Ahl Zin El Fassi!..
Morocco on current TV..
My South Park Character!..
Ummah Films on current.tv !! HELP NEEDED..
Ana Smayti Sa3id!..
 
2006
Al-Hawli Jokes..
Zawiya Qadiriya Boudchichiya Open Air Speech..
US Patent by Sa Majeste H. Roi du Maroc..
Jahh Bless Mon! Feeling down to earth tonight!..
Cannot Believe These Idiots!..
NESS LA CITY: All?e Sans Retour! LOL..
When Lotfi Attar Rides Matabkish wave! You Lissann mon!..
KUDOS TO Cheikh Sidi Bemol & Band!!..
No Comment! DARRITOUNI.....
Mortality Meets Online Status..
Michael Richard Busted and Sorry!..
The UMMA Clinic..
Hanane Fadili Take on Shouaffa(tt)..
Hijab: Strict Code or Fashion Barcode ..
To The Fasting Darling..
Rimitti: Ana Li Ghrasset aNakhla....
Reminiscing Tex Avery Cartoons!..
Happiest Guy in Morocco!..
The Super-cool Hanane Fadili..
Cette Affaire d'Avions ? Londres..
Watch 2M Television..
American Muslim Fun Video Blogging!..
Open War in the Middle East?..
Touche Po a Mon Zidane!..
Ronaldinho Joined Zawya....
Marock!..
Draw Live!..
Zoo Animals Need e'space..
Les ABRANIS: Prodigy of Rockabyl..
Sofiane Saidi: Cet Algerien Trip-rai Hopper..
Lemchaheb Legacy ..
Zahra Hindi, Beautiful You!..
Jajouka's Winds of Moroccana..
Google Language Translation: English to/from Arabic..
Aziz Mekouar, Ambassador of the Kingdom of Morocco to the US..
Google Shoots Microsoft.. One.. More.... Time!..
Monsieux Mehdi Ben Barka: Un Marocain Assassiné Qui Visait P..
Yale, Taliban and Weld L'Hashemi....
Near-eastern Muslim Scholars..
Three Algerians on Highway =]..
Moroccan Riverdance!..
Moroccan Candle-toe Dance..
Moroccan Qassida: Vraie Poesie!..
LA3MARNA Legacy..
Chilling Like a Mqedem in Morocco..
Alone in the Wilderness..
Are Iranians and Americans Blowing it Up?..
Are we a virus..?..
How come Morocco is silent to Dalfour, Sudan?..
Barreling Towards an Iraqi Civil War..
Pomme and Kelly ..
Intelligent Design and Evolution in not so American lands..
The Prophets animated by Steve Whitehouse..
More with Claudio Bravo..
Muslim Texans..
Hajj Stampede Gone Ugly!..
Self-portraits 001-002..
Why Faith?..
Online 7awli Souk!..
2006 !..
 
2005
Derbouka Bled Attack..
Adopted HIV kids from Romania..
Operation Mapping Raioo Love!..
They burnt themselves.. Come'on!..
My Winamp Skin: The New Beetle..
The Forbidden Zone film that electrified me!..
Cousins skyblogging..
Chilean artist in Morocco..
Moroccan Blue tops colors!..
Osama in FAMILY GUY..
Baraka Art..
Itsy Bitsy knowledge..
The most misunderstood [and growing..] world religion, Islam..
Moroccan Christians..
Polygamy in USA..
Architecturing to joy!..
This Moorish cult in America..
The Magnificient King Vulture..
Al-Rashid and the Fart..
On the subject of Evil Eye..
Anecdote on Life and 3ibada..
Anecdote on Giving in Time of Need..
T-shirt design: L'Amoureux!..
Craig Thompson art..
The Real Origin of Smileys :)..
T-shirt design: Happy Sailor!..
T-shirt design: threadless in Kufi..
T-shirt design: Magic e-lamp..
My August '05 T-shirt Designs ..
Your Living Space..
The Raioo Story: 2. in the garden..
The Raioo Story: 1. intro..
Arabic Beat and Instrument Music Wanted!..
 
2004
RA?NA RAI Legacy..
Algerian Chaabi..
Nour L'Koufi (Gharnati)..
Hidalgo in Morocco..
Le Secret d'Elissa Rhais..
Imam Shafii. Soni N'nafssa..
Feqqas (Moroccan Biscuiti)..
Casablanca Connect..
 
2003
ZEBDA! Un Groupe Genial!..
Al Moutanabbi. Idha Ghamarta..
Imam Shafii. sa'fir tajid 3iwada..
boston.food.Tangierino..
Long Distance Honey ..
The Working Wife and Husband..
The Hammam Public Bath: Do you still go there?..
Hip Hop Classic Favorites!..
Down With Love..
Lord Of The Rings..
How To create a Moroccan remix of a video clip ? ..
 
2002
Why we don't eat Porc?..
Do You Play Music?..
Hidoura: Your Moroccan Natural Carpet..
Khaddouj Slam-dunking From Marrakesh To New York..


FAVORITES
Hmida Rass Lmida à L'Avare de Molière!
Moroccan City Names
Shining ability is a gift...
Halloween SPECIAL 2007: La Mort D'une Souri!
Cheikha Rimitti: 83 Years of Life...
Why do we pray ?
short ones
ABSOLUTE RAIOO Summer 2007 Rai vol.2
Cheba Zohra & Mahadattes de Rilizane
Close Encounters of the Moroccan Kind!
Biyouna
Another attempt at writing. Will this language ever feel natural?
North Africa Journal
Moroccan Tattoos
From Los Angeles to Casablanca!
Amina Alaoui Lyrics
Dr. Hassan Al-Turabi
Vulgarity as revolution: Lemsakh we tsalguit
Les Oiseaux De Figuig!
ghir bessyas a moulay!
QURAN FLASH
Moroccan Playing Cards Game ronda v1.0
A Call From Algeria to Help Suffering Little Boy Mounib!
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